Reefs.org Forums

[dizzy]

Race even if a fish lives through the journey from collector to hobbyist and spends a few years in a glass cage............... it is kind of hard to make the case that it is better off than if it was left in the ocean. Don't you think?

[aquaticvet1]

Mitch there is also a difference in perception to the public and Washington too. Dead fish in my facility or yours do not make the news but when fish are smuggled, caught illegally or otherwise confiscated by Fish and Wildlife for sloppy paperwork etc then it becomes news. Not saying it is right but we should work to avoid the obvious and continue to reduce deaths all along the way. Sorry, back to the Clippertons as was intended by the thread starter.

[aquaticvet1]

Mitch, I cannot and will not make that case. As I said, I struggle with the whole concept but am trying to get better educated and improve with my own contributions.

The day will come when an undercover group does an expose on the trade and it will be devastating. With all the walk ins allowed at the wholesale level it is just a matter of time before the cameras roll in for a national story. It will happen at the retail shop level too. The Clippertons and other issues like it will be the seeds that set the stage. Just the way it is.

[dizzy]

Race instead of trying to suggest that fish benefit from the hobby, I think we should argue that man benefits from the hobby. BTW I just don't see how trying to blow up the Clipperton ordeal is good for the industry.

PS
If Cass Sunstein gets though the confirmation process perhaps the Clippertons angels relatives will be allowed to bring litigation.

[aquaticvet1]

I agree with you Mitch. I will end the discussion on the Clippertons.

[Terra Ferma]

This senseless " bucket full " of fish is one of the reasons we need change in this industry. These Clippertons should be made the poster child of wrong in this industry, I will do my best to accomplish that. I am digging in for confirmation but from what is rumored the majority or all are DEAD.

Who killed them?

Beats me, but it sure as sunshine wasn't the importer, as he apparently was not allowed to keep them!

[aquaticvet1]

Of course not. This is America where nothing is ever the fault of those who actually initiated the problem in the first place, always somebody elses. I have all my answers and for me, this case is closed.

[rgbmatt]

The day will come when an undercover group does an expose on the trade and it will be devastating. With all the walk ins allowed at the wholesale level it is just a matter of time before the cameras roll in for a national story. It will happen at the retail shop level too. The Clippertons and other issues like it will be the seeds that set the stage. Just the way it is.

People are already working on this, trust me. The industry needs to prepare itself.

However, I doubt that the clipperton incident will be particularly significant in the big picture.

[Terra Ferma]

The day will come when an undercover group does an expose on the trade and it will be devastating. With all the walk ins allowed at the wholesale level it is just a matter of time before the cameras roll in for a national story. It will happen at the retail shop level too. The Clippertons and other issues like it will be the seeds that set the stage. Just the way it is.

People are already working on this, trust me. The industry needs to prepare itself.

However, I doubt that the clipperton incident will be particularly significant in the big picture.

I too do not think that a paperwork error will have a meaningful impact on the downfall of livestock importation. If I was a tree hugger (which I am), I would be more concerned about animal husbandry in our food supply, regarding issues such as this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFJ5FQ41Md0